Post by Messenger on Feb 20, 2008 22:19:50 GMT -5
First, let's see what the Catholic Church says:
www.newadvent.org/cathen/04215b.htm
Ok, first we have this:
PERFECT?
?
NOBODY is perfect but Christ!
Then we have this:
I. PRESENT PRACTICE AND DOCTRINE
Rite
In the Western Church the sacrament is usually administered by the bishop. At the beginning of the ceremony there is a general imposition of hands, the bishop meantime praying that the Holy Ghost may come down upon those who have already been regenerated: "send forth upon them thy sevenfold Spirit the Holy Paraclete." He then anoints the forehead of each with chrism saying: "I sign thee with the sign of the cross and confirm thee with the chrism of salvation, in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost." Finally, he gives each a slight blow on the cheek saying: "peace be with thee". A prayer is added that the Holy Spirit may dwell in the hearts of those who have been confirmed, and the rite closes with the bishop's blessing.
This is nothing but ritual, & doesn't confirm salvation or anything else!
Look at what Jesus said here:
John 14:6 (New International Version)
Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
Does Jesus say that ANYONE can come to the Father through confirmation?
Does Jesus say that we can be saved through comfirmation?
NO, NO, NO!
We can ONLY approach the Father through HIM!
NOTHING ELSE!!!!!!!!
And there is this:
The Eastern Church omits the imposition of hands and the prayer at the beginning, and accompanies the anointing with the words: "the sign [or seal] of the gift of the Holy Ghost." These several actions symbolize the nature and purpose of the sacrament: the anointing signifies the strength given for the spiritual conflict; the balsam contained in the chrism, the fragrance of virtue and the good odor of Christ; the sign of the cross on the forehead, the courage to confess Christ, before all men; the imposition of hands and the blow on the cheek, enrollment in the service of Christ which brings true peace to the soul. (Cf. St. Thomas, III:72:4).
This is nothing but ritual! These procedure are NOT mentioned ANYWHERE in The Bible! They don't do ANYTHING!
And there is this:
Confirmation imparts an increase of sanctifying grace which makes the recipient a "perfect Christian";
a special sacramental grace consisting in the seven gifts of the Holy Ghost and notably in the strength and courage to confess boldly the name of Christ;
an indelible character by reason of which the sacrament cannot be received again by the same person.
NO IT DOESN'T!!!!
The catholic church is making ITSELF the imparter of spiritual power, when it is the HOLY SPIRIT that imparts spiritual blessing!
They are making themselves GOD!
And there is this:
On the other hand, its reception is obligatory (necessitate præcepti) "for all those who are able to understand and fulfill the Commandments of God and of the Church. This is especially true of those who suffer persecution on account of their religion or are exposed to grievous temptations against faith or are in danger of death. The more serious the danger so much greater is the need of protecting oneself". (Conc. Plen. Balt. II, n. 250.) As to the gravity of the obligation, opinions differ, some theologians holding that an unconfirmed person would commit mortal sin if he refused the sacrament, others that the sin would be at most venial unless the refusal implied contempt for the sacrament. Apart, however, from such controversies the importance of confirmation as a means of grace is so obvious that no earnest Christian will neglect it, and in particular that Christian parents will not fail to see that their children are confirmed.
Obligatory? Since when?
Did Jesus ever say that ANYTHING else was needed to restrore a human's relatonship?
NO! NO! NO! NO! NO!
Jesus said this:
John 14:6 (New International Version)
6Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
Do I need to go on?
Ritual doesn't save a person!
Tradition doesn't save a person!
Sacrements don't save a person!
Only Jesus, by His death On the cross, & His subsequent resurrection, can save a person!
Everything that I have listed here falls undre the catagory or "works", & "works"
DON'T save a person!
Scripture SAYS they don't, as seen here:
Ephesians 2:8-9 (New International Version)
8For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9not by works, so that no one can boast.
Need I say any more?
Bill
www.newadvent.org/cathen/04215b.htm
Ok, first we have this:
Confirmation
A sacrament in which the Holy Ghost is given to those already baptized in order to make them strong and perfect Christians and soldiers of Jesus Christ.
A sacrament in which the Holy Ghost is given to those already baptized in order to make them strong and perfect Christians and soldiers of Jesus Christ.
PERFECT?
?NOBODY is perfect but Christ!
Then we have this:
I. PRESENT PRACTICE AND DOCTRINE
Rite
In the Western Church the sacrament is usually administered by the bishop. At the beginning of the ceremony there is a general imposition of hands, the bishop meantime praying that the Holy Ghost may come down upon those who have already been regenerated: "send forth upon them thy sevenfold Spirit the Holy Paraclete." He then anoints the forehead of each with chrism saying: "I sign thee with the sign of the cross and confirm thee with the chrism of salvation, in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost." Finally, he gives each a slight blow on the cheek saying: "peace be with thee". A prayer is added that the Holy Spirit may dwell in the hearts of those who have been confirmed, and the rite closes with the bishop's blessing.
This is nothing but ritual, & doesn't confirm salvation or anything else!
Look at what Jesus said here:
John 14:6 (New International Version)
Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
Does Jesus say that ANYONE can come to the Father through confirmation?
Does Jesus say that we can be saved through comfirmation?
NO, NO, NO!
We can ONLY approach the Father through HIM!
NOTHING ELSE!!!!!!!!
And there is this:
The Eastern Church omits the imposition of hands and the prayer at the beginning, and accompanies the anointing with the words: "the sign [or seal] of the gift of the Holy Ghost." These several actions symbolize the nature and purpose of the sacrament: the anointing signifies the strength given for the spiritual conflict; the balsam contained in the chrism, the fragrance of virtue and the good odor of Christ; the sign of the cross on the forehead, the courage to confess Christ, before all men; the imposition of hands and the blow on the cheek, enrollment in the service of Christ which brings true peace to the soul. (Cf. St. Thomas, III:72:4).
This is nothing but ritual! These procedure are NOT mentioned ANYWHERE in The Bible! They don't do ANYTHING!
And there is this:
Confirmation imparts an increase of sanctifying grace which makes the recipient a "perfect Christian";
a special sacramental grace consisting in the seven gifts of the Holy Ghost and notably in the strength and courage to confess boldly the name of Christ;
an indelible character by reason of which the sacrament cannot be received again by the same person.
NO IT DOESN'T!!!!
The catholic church is making ITSELF the imparter of spiritual power, when it is the HOLY SPIRIT that imparts spiritual blessing!
They are making themselves GOD!
And there is this:
On the other hand, its reception is obligatory (necessitate præcepti) "for all those who are able to understand and fulfill the Commandments of God and of the Church. This is especially true of those who suffer persecution on account of their religion or are exposed to grievous temptations against faith or are in danger of death. The more serious the danger so much greater is the need of protecting oneself". (Conc. Plen. Balt. II, n. 250.) As to the gravity of the obligation, opinions differ, some theologians holding that an unconfirmed person would commit mortal sin if he refused the sacrament, others that the sin would be at most venial unless the refusal implied contempt for the sacrament. Apart, however, from such controversies the importance of confirmation as a means of grace is so obvious that no earnest Christian will neglect it, and in particular that Christian parents will not fail to see that their children are confirmed.
Obligatory? Since when?
Did Jesus ever say that ANYTHING else was needed to restrore a human's relatonship?
NO! NO! NO! NO! NO!
Jesus said this:
John 14:6 (New International Version)
6Jesus answered, "I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.
Do I need to go on?
Ritual doesn't save a person!
Tradition doesn't save a person!
Sacrements don't save a person!
Only Jesus, by His death On the cross, & His subsequent resurrection, can save a person!
Everything that I have listed here falls undre the catagory or "works", & "works"
DON'T save a person!
Scripture SAYS they don't, as seen here:
Ephesians 2:8-9 (New International Version)
8For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9not by works, so that no one can boast.
Need I say any more?
Bill
